5th centre fin for Sweet Potato

[C0111N5]

Hello Firewire Community

I'm just after some feedback from the Firewire R&D Team and the online Community in regards to an idea I have for my 5'2" Sweet Potato.

After seeing a recent FW Tweet about the 'Von Sol knub', I was wondering how would a Sweet Potato perform with a 5th centre fin option with a Von Sol knub (http://www.vonsol.com/performancefins.html) in place?

Would it:

> allow for more stable, agressive turning?
> provide more grip/control in more punchy/steeper waves?
> provide more drive?
> look cool? : )
> or could it completely ruin the dynamics of the board?

In the last case, I am tempted to go ahead anyway with getting a local shaper to add an extra fin box (Futures) and if it doesn't work, fill it with a box filler. I'd be worried about ruining the V in the tail though.

If it could work, what would be the most optimal position?

> Inline with the rear fins?
> Slightly behind the rear fins?
> Slightly in front of the rear fins?

Id be guessing 'slightly behind the rear fins' would be optimal as with all the 5 fin boards.

Please feel free to let me know what you think. I have a big urge to experiment after seeing that little Von Sol knub fin. If I can add more stoke to a board, I am all for it!

Cheers!

[iggy]

The fin positioning on the board was not designed for a thruster. Too much of a tail to be throwing a center fin in the mix.
In my opininon it will slow the board and make those turns quite hard to do. It will take away from the board more than anything

[saxman1]

Not a good idea. There is no high density foam to anchor a fin plug into so it wont be very strong. I was tempted to do the same on my quadraflex because the knub runs so well on my dominator.

[prjwebb]

If you were to do it, a single FCS plug would be better. Minimal carnage.

[C0111N5]

Bummer, didn't know about the variety of foam density, thanks saxman1.

Thanks for the tip prjwebb, that is a good idea to go with FCS.

Unless I get any positive feedback I'd say I might have to trash the idea, worth a crack!

[prjwebb]

Is the board RF or FST?

[C0111N5]

Rapid Fire

[prjwebb]

I think it would be fairly easy for someone to do on an RF board. That's not to say it'll be worth doing though, but it could be magic.

[prjwebb]

Id suggest cutting out a square, sticking a higher density cube of foam in there with epoxy and then fitting a single FCS plug from there. Glass other the new area with 2 layers of 4oz cloth and it should be solid.
I'd get someone who knows what they are doing to do the work if you do go ahead with it though, would be a shame to mess up a great board.
Would love to hear the result if you take the gamble!

[C0111N5]

For sure, if I do it I would definitely be getting a pro to do it, would hate to ruin the V in the tail and more.

I'll wait and see if we get a reply from Chris or anyone else from FW before going ahead, in the mean time I might order a couple of Knub's.

[Slowman]

Hmmm, I don't know how much you'd gain from it because the board has a double concave the centre ridge is already giving you something to pivot around I would think. I have a bat tail quad with a double concave in the rear half and it pivots like a thruster so that makes me wonder if you would gain much. Maybe with that wide tail on the SP it might help if you ever felt it was wallowing around.

[iggy]

Carnage!!!

[iggy]

Id suggest cutting out a square, sticking a higher density cube of foam in there with epoxy and then fitting a single FCS plug from there. Glass other the new area with 2 layers of 4oz cloth and it should be solid.
I'd get someone who knows what they are doing to do the work if you do go ahead with it though, would be a shame to mess up a great board.
Would love to hear the result if you take the gamble!

Carnage

[Slowman]

Maybe try a shaping a knubby fin from a piece of plastic from a T shape extrusion. Then you could stick it on using some silicon glue temporarily to see what you get, if anything, from a 5th fin.

[prjwebb]

Glass one on!

[Slowman]

Glass one on!
You can always sand it off if you don't like it LOL.

[Chris]

yeah tough call. i think it could be fun, but to me, the primary purpose of a knub is to give a quad more control in surf where you are carrying enough speed to bang off wrapping maneuvers. Essentially you want the pivot or arch of a thruster without the drag of a proper center fin.

To me, the potato is great in the conditions it is designed to be ridden in. If it gets big or fast enough for me to want the feeling of a thruster, then I am jumping on a different board. I personally wouldn't add a center box because of the double concave and the tail is SO wide.

The potatonator is a different story because i think its actually a board that you would ride in better conditions where you might want the feeling of a thruster....

[C0111N5]

Thanks Chris! A Potatonator would solve my issue but I have a HellRazor on my list first ; )

The main reason why I thought of the idea is because I really enjoy going warp-speed on my SP and thought a Knubster may help with holding and tightening my turns.

I find you can go too fast to turn on the SP, especially with the Controller fins in where the board will skip out when pushed too hard. The Elevons seem to be a little more forgiving.

I'll sit on the idea for now but will report back if I give it a try. Don't think I would go with the glassed fin idea but thanks guy's : )

[cuttlefish]

I was all set to buy a spud and I came across the P'nator and had to buy it.
But I am still keen on a spud.
So if I buy one I'm getting one in FST so I get the FCS fin plugs then I'm going to give Webber curves a run on it because those fins have some serious hold which could negate any desire for a knubster.
I'm planning on a 6'er so I'll have 51 litres of volume to support my 95kg and 49 yr old body and make a complete pig of myself.
Talking to Sutto from Beachbeat today and he reckons he's tried MR TFX's, Stretches and controllers and was a bit dissapointed he didn't notice all that much difference.
He tends to ride his spud as strictly a groveller though.
Reckon I'll have to test ride one first though.
Most of the time when I see people riding sweet potatoes locally I don't see them doing anything too noteworthy on them.
They aren't catching anymore waves than anyone else or ripping it up.
Then I'll see the odd character who's all over the waves and they look like a tonne of fun.

[Chris]

enjoy that board cuttle!

FYI you can get both techs in both fins...

[cuttlefish]

thanks Chris.
The owner of the local surf shops' 5'10" will be mine for a spin this morning.

High tide, small (1-2') beachbreaks on offer. Sweet potato territory.
At least all my curiosities will be addressed by taking one for a spin.
We can all talk until we're blue in the face but it only goes so far and ultimately the proof is in the riding.
I know for my height (6'1") weight (92-95 kgs) and skill level Adv/Int I'd be on a 5'4" or so but the age has to be taken into account.
Sure I can ride a tiny board sometimes but it's more hard work than I'm interested in and surfing flat out with big manouvres all over the place can have me waking up the next morning feeling like I've been beaten up (P'nator but "oh, what a feeling") .
So I'm going for the cruisier end of the spectrum. I've had a 5'6" mini-simmons with 43 litres of volume long before the Sweet potato appeared and it's Achilles heel was being able to paddle fast enough in a crowded point line up to nett me my fair share of waves.
That's why I'm interested in extra length and volume. I recall reading over in the old forum archives of some posters saying longboarders would paddle past them like they were standing still...or they could not catch many waves compared to their longboards. I'm always competing with longboarders for waves and they are super greedy where I live.
It will be interesting to see what my next post reveals after riding the 5'10". Too much board...spot on...or just a few litres more in a 6'er thanks?
I'm predicting 6' X 23" X 3" is my set of numbers. Spent 11 years in Thailand and the Thai made 6' Sweet potato has great set of Buddhist numbers. The number 3 and multiples of. :-)

[prjwebb]

I took a 508 SP out for a spin and it paddled a lot quicker than any of my other boards. It didn't have the glide of a longboard but it did shift.
I found you couldn't really catch a small lump way out like a longboard either and the best bet was a well positioned take off with 1 or 2 paddles. Once in the wave though the thing takes off. Key was to get your weight on the tail though. I imagine the PN is similar.
The trouble with going oversized though, when you're surfing right off the tail your front foot can end up too far back to weight back down the face after a top turn.
That was my experience anyway. Looking forward to hearing how you get on. I was addicted after one session and have a 5'2" on the way for summer.

[cuttlefish]

Took the 5'10" for a paddle.
Full high tide trying to swallow 2' of swell, offshore and a few out on longboards and shortboards.
The board paddled well and I duckdove it with no issues.
Not too bad at catching waves and it's speed off the mark is a kick.
Great planing across the flats and easy enough to go vertical.
I had no issues with it being too large and/or corky.
The longboarders still had the advantage for sure.
Need to up the ante and go for the 6'er to even things up or its a waste of time buying one when I have the P'nator already.
Went back and looked at the 5'10" and the 6'er side by side and there's not a lot of difference. The 5'10" had me floating at just above my belly button with the board level underneath me. The 5'10" was loose enough that I know I can trade off a tiny bit of manouvreability for increased paddle power.
It is after all a pure groveller so wave catching is premium. If I want to do turns that make my old heart sing when it's smokin' waves I can grab the P'nator or my 6'4" dynocore anyway.
The P'nator is still the board for surfing top to bottom snaps, off the top gouges and little pumps to get the board flying along a wall. The P'nator is still the board that Spitfire/Dominator owners will feel right at home on whereas the sweet potato will be a bit alien (at first) for most.
Luckily I'm used to a mini-simmons so there was no acclimation necessary for me.
The sweet potato is more a, drop into the wave and let the planing area do its thing, with no need to pump for speed if you don't want.

[Chris]

good stuff cuttle.

[iggy]

P'nator is still the board for surfing top to bottom snaps, off the top gouges and little pumps to get the board flying along a wall. The P'nator is still the board that Spitfire/Dominator owners will feel right at home on whereas the sweet potato will be a bit alien (at first) for most.
Luckily I'm used to a mini-simmons so there was no acclimation necessary for me.
The sweet potato is more a, drop into the wave and let the planing area do its thing, with no need to pump for speed if you don't want.
Simple and concise

[Chris]

poetic....as a poet aficionado might say....

[SDsurf]

Would it:

> allow for more stable, agressive turning?
> provide more grip/control in more punchy/steeper waves?
> provide more drive?
> look cool? : )
> or could it completely ruin the dynamics of the board?

In the last case, I am tempted to go ahead anyway with getting a local shaper to add an extra fin box (Futures) and if it doesn't work, fill it with a box filler. I'd be worried about ruining the V in the tail though.

If it could work, what would be the most optimal position?

> Inline with the rear fins?
> Slightly behind the rear fins?
> Slightly in front of the rear fins?

I got my Potato from Bird down here in San Diego. He had Roper put in that 5th fin on his, a 5'4 I think. Bird swore by it. He said it provided more stability and had surfed it "double overhead." Not sure about that, but whatever.

His was placed slightly behind the rear fins, and was FCS so he had the option to move it up also, which would have put it sort of even with the rear fins I think.

I personally like the feeling of the SP being able to slide the fins out when you want to, I think the 5th fin would eliminate that option.

Just my opinion