Pnator v Addvance for up to head high

[STC67]

I am looking at a board for smaller conditions to supplement my quiver. I am posting here as I know Cuttle has had experience with both these Boards so hoping for his feedback.

I currently have the Elf which I found good for chest to a bit over head high. I feel it is more suited to a slightly open faced wave but I find needs a bit of size to work properly. I'm still getting used to front foot surfing so maybe this range will widen with more time.

I have a 7'10 Mctavish UF8 which handles as big as I want to go and also is suited to a steeper wave. I therefore default from the ELF to the UF8 when 1 1/2 head high or maybe head high if the wave is steeper.

Since I sold my 702 Addvance (I should probably not have sold it) and SP I no longer have anything for the bottom end that I thought the ELF might cover, but don't yet feel comfortable that it can. I don't want to go a SP again as I want a good crossover with the ELF. Ie up to at least chest high and handle some steepness. I am prepared to sacrifice very bottom end grovel ability for that because many a time I have paddled out to find the waves a bit bigger and steeper than I thought they were looking from the beach. My surfing is not high performance, it's more about catching waves and having fun.

I am considering a 604/606 Potatonator or a 606/610 Addvance. The reviews on the Potatonator look fantastic but looking at the foils it is very flat rockered (more than the Addvance or ELF) and I like my boards with a bit of volume around 50litres. The Elf is only 45l but feels a little small in the small stuff.

My question is can you surf the Potatonator a little over volumed? And then am I asking too much of it when confronted with a head high steeper wave? I know the ADDvance will handle these conditions but will probably sacrifice some performance in the real small stuff.

Cuttle - before you start on you don't need a 606 P-nator at 95kgs, I don't get as much surf time as you so while I might have you by a few years, you will get me on fitness and general ability.

[cuttlefish]

Hi Stc,
I'm the last person to talk you out of some extra foam.
Looking at the volume charts are interesting.
If we go back a bit in time pre sweet potato and potatonator, the recommendation in the 50 litre range would have been pointing towards the 6'8" dom or the 6'6" addvance.
Interesting because the 2" increases in length for the dom carried an almost 5 litre difference.
The addvance 6'6"-6'10" is a big jump of 8.9 litres.
So you would have selected a 6'8" dom or a 6'6" addvance.
Having pointed that out the potatonator litreages are increasing in 3 litre (approx) steps for each 2"s.
So the differences are going to be more subtle.
The 6'6" addvance wouldn't be my choice as a groveller for you as I used mine (48 litres) as other lighter and younger crew would as an everyday shortboard.
It came into it's own when the waves were waist high plus.
Surfing Maroochydore a lot we have banks that quite often break out the back then back off in deeper water before shorebreak reforms during the upper tide range.
The addvance being a wide point forward shape would plane ok across the dead sections when it was smaller.
BUT
I'd step back to turn the board and then lose the advantage of the foam underfoot when standing more forward, due to the narrower tail and the board would bog if not careful.
The sweet potato excels in this capacity with its skim-like glide allowing one to do what only those only longboards can normally achieve (ie connect the two banks).
What you'll get with the longer potatonator with it's wide point back and sweet potato like volume under foot is some of that glide you'll need to cross those sections while supporting your weight.
Don't be at all concerned about the 6'6" potatonator handling a decent sized wave because you'll have the extra rail line (all of an inch more than the El feugo).
The 6'6" potatonator will actually feel shorter in the water when paddling compared to the El feugo due to its more pulled in nose.
The v in the nose really helps with steeper takeoffs although its rocker is low.
Provided the 6'2" sweet potato you had didn't feel corky to you in the small stuff the 6'6" potatonator definitely won't as you're going longer and with a sleeker planshape in the nose.
We all have Geoff McCoy to thank for the shapes that spawned boards like the potatonator.
You've got the volume under your feet where you need it in less powerful waves.
Too bad Mr McCoy stay rooted on poly construction (rather than embracing eps- a big guys friend) and glass on thrusters.
Don't forget all the wide point forward 70's single fin pintails were built for good waves not small, gutless waves.
The compromise was made to suffer through the average stuff to have a board which would hold in the good waves.
Now we have the average surfer with a 3 board and beyond quiver tailoring their boards to all the conditions we will encounter.
Go for it with the 6'6" I say because you're going to get an easy to surf well board in ordinary conditions.

[Chris]

thanks cuttle for taking the time to give such a great response.

STC, i am absolutely, unequivocally behind you getting the Potatonator IF you are actually going to use the board in small stuff. If you think you are going to be getting into head high, or bigger, steep waves often, you might prefer the Addvance. But if you are thinking you'll be more down in the waist to shoulder high range normally, I think the Potatonator is the shape. so much versatility, and if you go 606, you'll have great ease of use!!

Cheers and hope this helps!

[STC67]

Thanks Cuttle for your time responding. Informative as usual.

Chris, I intend to go to the Elf over about chest/head high so I think the Pnator can fit in the ottom end

[iggy]

Hi Stc,
I'm the last person to talk you out of some extra foam.
Looking at the volume charts are interesting.
If we go back a bit in time pre sweet potato and potatonator, the recommendation in the 50 litre range would have been pointing towards the 6'8" dom or the 6'6" addvance.
Interesting because the 2" increases in length for the dom carried an almost 5 litre difference.
The addvance 6'6"-6'10" is a big jump of 8.9 litres.
So you would have selected a 6'8" dom or a 6'6" addvance.
Having pointed that out the potatonator litreages are increasing in 3 litre (approx) steps for each 2"s.
So the differences are going to be more subtle.
The 6'6" addvance wouldn't be my choice as a groveller for you as I used mine (48 litres) as other lighter and younger crew would as an everyday shortboard.
It came into it's own when the waves were waist high plus.
Surfing Maroochydore a lot we have banks that quite often break out the back then back off in deeper water before shorebreak reforms during the upper tide range.
The addvance being a wide point forward shape would plane ok across the dead sections when it was smaller.
BUT
I'd step back to turn the board and then lose the advantage of the foam underfoot when standing more forward, due to the narrower tail and the board would bog if not careful.
The sweet potato excels in this capacity with its skim-like glide allowing one to do what only those only longboards can normally achieve (ie connect the two banks).
What you'll get with the longer potatonator with it's wide point back and sweet potato like volume under foot is some of that glide you'll need to cross those sections while supporting your weight.
Don't be at all concerned about the 6'6" potatonator handling a decent sized wave because you'll have the extra rail line (all of an inch more than the El feugo).
The 6'6" potatonator will actually feel shorter in the water when paddling compared to the El feugo due to its more pulled in nose.
The v in the nose really helps with steeper takeoffs although its rocker is low.
Provided the 6'2" sweet potato you had didn't feel corky to you in the small stuff the 6'6" potatonator definitely won't as you're going longer and with a sleeker planshape in the nose.
We all have Geoff McCoy to thank for the shapes that spawned boards like the potatonator.
You've got the volume under your feet where you need it in less powerful waves.
Too bad Mr McCoy stay rooted on poly construction (rather than embracing eps- a big guys friend) and glass on thrusters.
Don't forget all the wide point forward 70's single fin pintails were built for good waves not small, gutless waves.
The compromise was made to suffer through the average stuff to have a board which would hold in the good waves.
Now we have the average surfer with a 3 board and beyond quiver tailoring their boards to all the conditions we will encounter.
Go for it with the 6'6" I say because you're going to get an easy to surf well board in ordinary conditions.

Bravo!!,this reflects the pure essence of this forum!

[cuttlefish]

Just another bit of information.
I'm interested in demoing a 5'11" baked potato (don't muddy the decision making process) and called Firewire Currumbin and spoke to Nicky to see if they had any in stock as demos.
She checked for me and said "No" but would happily give me a newie to demo.
No strings were pulled, no mention of enthusiastic forum participation (LOL) just a simple anonymous phone call.
I bet if I come down and one is turned into a demo you'd be up for trying it though?
I'd hazard to guess they may not have a 6'6" potatonator as a demo in stock but would be able to do the same for you.
Even my local surf shop ordered in a new 5'8" fst, fcs shod, sweet potato for me to demo.
If I didn't want it they would happily keep it as a demo in their shop. No charge involved.
I bought it by the way.
One can but ask.

[STC67]

Thanks Cuttle, but I don't think I am heading down a Baked Potato path. I had a good look at one and to be honest I thought it had too much SP in its genes for what I intended it for as I am looking for a slightly wider wave range than the SP I had. I can't see how the suttle differences between the BP and SP could make that much difference.

I just rang Nicki at FW Currumbin and they have a 602 Pnator for demo. As they won't charge me to borrow it I will give that a go? That would be the same literage as my ELF. I don't have any problems catching waves on the ELF, it just feels a bit small on a smaller wave, maybe the same literage and a wider tail would be OK but I want to try first.

Thanks for the heads up. I'm looking at Greeny at the moment and thinking a Pnator could go pretty well.

[STC67]

OK. Didn't get to demo a Pnator as I went to the factory and the annual sale was on and it was a bit kaotic.

I did pick up a 6'10 Hellfire which will be my head high plus wave board. Surfed it this morning in 2-3 ft soft waves, which it probably wasn't suited for, but I wanted to see how it went. I was surprised how well it paddled and caught waves given some previous comments (must be the extra volume 47.7 ). I still haven't got back hand and late take offs wired yet on the board, or got to surf it aggressively from the tail pad, but in all pretty happy after 1 session in small waves.

Given how easy it was to catch waves, I am now thinking I could get buy with a 6'4 Pnator instead of the intended 6'6 which would be very near the same volume as the Hellfire (47.7 HF v's 47.4PN). Am I correctly assuming that the Pnator should paddle as well, if not better, than the Hellfire given a flatter rocker?

Thanks

[prjwebb]

I always wondered the same about lack of small wave ability from the Hellfire. It looks like it'd go really well in anything over belly button height to me, as long as it wasn't completely mushy of course.
Here's a ittle video of my mate Rory surfing his 5'8" Hellfire in some average and slack waves around here in between interview segments. I think as long as you keep the board moving under you feet and generating lift it looks like a good all rounder.

[benny81]

STC67 I'm in the same boat as you, my fuego is great but in open faced good size waves then it really comes into its own, unfourtunatly for me thats not very often.

My PN though goes great in knee high plus normally rubbish wind swell and high tide, so that quiver has me covered and my fuego will be reserved for when its on!