I would probably go with the 6'4"... Maybe the 6'2"
The dominator is all about volume, not ony in quantity, but most importantly in distribution.

iggy - thanks. Interesting, the 6' 4" is 41 litres...I'll have a squiz at one and see what I feel / think about it

One other thing - I'm 40 years old. Not the oldest, but not the youngest of surfers

Question for you.
When you're sitting in the water on the zot with the board level in the water underneath you where is the water level on your torso?
I'll have an educated guess and say your belly button.re you prepared to have your wave count plummet?
Fair to say most people riding McCoys are interested in having adequate floatation and subsequently are also used to duckdiving considerable slabs of foam.
I recall when I was 90 kgs test riding a 6'4" dom and the water level was at the bottom of my pecs.
The 6'6" had me floating at the bottom of my rib cage.
The 6'6" Addvance had me floating at belly button level.
I've ridden a 6'8" Astron zot and wondering what kind of feel your after with the new board?
If you're after a shortboard feel then the dom is the way to go. Lots of volume in the round tail ala McCoy so foam underneath the rear foot for planing area in smaller waves
If you want a fishier feel then an Addvance is worth looking at.
Wider nose and will be up and on plane to get you into waves early.
More pulled in tail than a dom so can handle good waves well and under the feet of a heavier guy you can pull vertical snaps really easily.
The majority on the forum will happily point you towards the dominator because they have no experience with the Addvances.
Worth keeping in mind.
Skinny, young surfers telling older, heavier surfers what they need doesn't not come from direct experience. 

How'd you find the zot anyways?

Cuttlefish - I love my Zot! However, I'm beginning to feel that it is a little too buoyant...I don't exactly know how to correctly answer your belly button vs Pec question as I haven't paid much attention to that in the past.

I will head out for a surf on the Zot and let you know the answer to your question.

More recently I have been surfing my sisters 7ft Mccocy FPD (I think it is) - it's a more retroish thruster from the 70's with the wide point slightly forward of centre. This board has less float than my Zot and seems to turn a little better.

I have also just purchased a Star fin for my Zot and have been trying it out - it's great and seems to help the board turn, it feels more responsive.

Regarding the feel that I am after - I really would like to steer clear of "fishier" feeling types of boards as I find the flat planing surface  and flattness of the board during take off to be a little unnerving....

I have also contemplated downsizing my Zot to a 6ft 8 Zot....this may well solve my needs...

Sorry for the rambling - I'll respond to your questions about belly button soon... thanks for the suggestions

6'6" Dom. 6'8" maybe even.

PS its hard to be 100% sure but the Astron Zot at 7' would have volume that's off the charts for the Dom. So 6'6" would be a big drop but still leave you at 97kg with adequate flotation.
PPS I surf a 6'6" McCoy nugget single fin at 90kg and 46 yoa.

If I was you...and I'm not!
I'd buy a 6'6" dom and but first be looking at a used one.
They come up from time to time on ebay.
Got an inkling my local shop has either a dom or spitfire in a 6'6" or 6'8" in their used racks.
I'll check today and get back to you.
That way you could find out if they work for you and still keep your zot.
I'd check with Firewire at Currumbin (warehouse) and see if anyone in Sydney has a 6'6" demo.
I've ridden a 6'8" zot and the 6'6" dom is a much more responsive board.
The difference will be in the speed of reaction to your input.
How's the Controllers Buzzy?
What I mean by this is when riding your zot you'll find when you think about a turn it will happen but not instantaneously.
The board doesn't react too quickly for your body to keep up with it.
I believe that's a reason why McCoys are so favoured by older, heavier surfers.
The dom will go into turns while your thinking about doing them.
A thinner, higher performance model will up the reaction times of the board to match the reaction times of the surfer.

BTW take a tape and measure the width of the nose 12"s from the end of the nose on your zot.
Is it cloes to 15"s?

Still haven't used them! Maybe tonight depending on conditions.

I spend a great deal of time reading this forum and I own 3 Firewires - all max sizes: dominator, sweet potato, and addvance - love all 3 but due to age, weight, and homebreak surfing conditions I ride the dominator the least.  The jist of this post is that 9 times out of 10 I agree with cuttlefish I terms of recommendations on model and size.  I grew up riding 5'10" thin boards but they just are not practical for me now.  Cuttlefish is the voice of reason for the over 40 200lb high obligation crowd and I appreciate that.  The volume calculator does not take much into consideration when making recommendations.  On this topic at 205 lbs I own the 6'10" dominator and have ridden the 6'10" addvance for a week - my last trip to CA.  While the dominator has me going more vertical than I have in years - the 6'10" addvance just works in so many more conditions - is insanely stable and a much better paddler - I like volume forward under my chest.  I do not find the addvance fishy at all and think it is as close to a one board quiver as firewire has to offer.  I ride my 7'6" addvance almost exclusively in the winter with all the wetsuit gear.  I am really excited about the potatonator.

Thanks everyone for the feedback - it's great....it's definitely got me thinking...

Cuttlefish - I went for a surf this morning on the Zot. It has me floating at my belly button level (as you put it), I'm expecting that a Dominator at 6' 6" will have me floating a little lower in the water - however, hopefully not quite as deep as Pec level.

Regarding the "controllers buz" - I'v never heard it referred to like that, however, I was noticing this morning that on the Zot I have plenty of time to think whilst the board responds to me...i.e.the turns aren't instantaneous. It's good to hear that the Dominator responds differently - that's what I am after....

Addvance vs Dominator - it's sounding to me like the Dominator may well be the go for me as I like having more Volume under foot.

Cuttlefish - your 6' 6" second hand suggestion is great. I will also call regarding a Demo board today - I think that Aloha in Manly may have one...

I definitely agree with cuttlefish on the 6'6" by the way. I added the 6'8" out of caution given the big board you are currently on. I'm 90kg approx and have the 6'4" Dom and really enjoy it. One caveat though - for me the Dom is a small wave board and at that volume I don't think it'd go particularly well too much above head high. That's the intended use for the design though (ie in conception) so that's not a significant concern.

If there's crumbly small waves this afternoon I'll make a point of whacking in the Controllers, and post some feedback.

I see there's a 6'6" Dom for sale on Aussie ebay. Looks like you can organise transport to Sydney too;

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/FireWire-Dominator-/150712685694?pt=AU_Sport_Surfing&hash=item23172d147e

Sorry NZed,
The reference to controllers was directed at Buzzy as I was curious if he'd tried the controller fins in his dom.
I edited my post and it put it smack in the middle of my post...weird.
Reason I asked about your zot's nose width is to see how close it is to an Addvance nose.
The Addvance has a late flip in the nose so it handles late drops much better than a traditional fish and the way it surfs isn't fish like as Sam has pointed out.
Your zot will probably have more nose rocker than the dom as well.
You may well find that you'd use a dom as an ordinary day board and even keep your zot for when it's a bit larger and it's slow reactivity is a bonus.
I figured the zot would have you floating belly button level. I'd say the 6'6" will float you at bottom of rib cage - 2nd rib.
Thanks Sam....I really like the Addvances as well and agree about the 6'10" and a one board quiver.
Well spotted on the used dom Buzzy.
Another thing worth mentioning is that Firewire at Currumbin have a blemish rack with minor cosmetic stuff usually that are a good deal.
Worth calling and asking if they have a 6'6" if you don't end up with a used one.
Also consider the spitfire 6'6".

The board at my local surfshop is a 6'8" spitfire rapidfire with Future's glass flex fins $550.
Ph No 07 5443 2777
With the tail on the 6'8" Spitfire it's worth thinking about.
Both of these boards Buzzy's ebay find and the surfshop one are on the Sunshine coast (my locale) and could be freighted down to Sydney with Nick from Surf freight ($90-95) and would arrive in same condition they left in, unlike courier freighted boards.

I just went and checked out some new Dominators in the local surf stores - the biggest that they had was a 6' 4" - it looks like a chip of a board compared to my 7ft McCoy...I haven't been able to have a squiz at a 6' 6" in real life...but I suspect that it's not much bigger than the 604 (in terms of overall size and volume).

It's interesting coming down from a 7 ft McCoy - it makes me really realise the amount of buoyancy in the McCoy...

Sorry, surfed it as a thruster again. Really enjoying it now. No more surfing until the weekend now absent a miracle.

It's 2"s bigger if that helps.

There's about 10% more volume in the 6'6" over the 6'4".

Cuttlefish - Imeasured the nose of my McCoy...it's 14 inches wide at the spot that's 12 inches from the front of the board.

I realise that there will be 10% more volume in the 606 - however, it's just interesting, as my initial reaction when I first looked at the 604 was "geez...it's tiny"...however, the 606 may well give the extra buoyancy required and this give me the responsiveness that I'm after.

Thanks for everyones comments / opinons

It definitely won't float you like the McCoy. Nothing floats like a Geoff McCoy McCoy! When Darren Rogers was with Geoff I got my boards from Darren as his boards were still chunky, but a little bit more refined (indeed my one mostly unridden McCoy is an old Darren Rogers one). Geoff just loves the foam! But the 6'6" will definitely have enough foam to float you. It may take some adjustment period but after you do adjust (and surfing 3-6 days a week that won't take long) you'll be really enjoying it.

I have the 6'4" and I'm 90kg and I'm really enjoying it. Frankly I reckon the foam volume is almost perfect for my intended use at my weight.

I just wanted to share a thought bubble by the way. Please don't hold me to precise figures...this is all ball park rough estimate stuff to illustrate a point.

So Kelly Slater is 72kgs and surfs a 5'9". I know this because I looked at his ASP Profile. Let's assume for the sake of argument that he surfs a SubScorcher in small surf. That's not an entirely unreasonable assumption because we know he loves the wider shorter stuff and ...Lost tells us lots of pros like the board. Plus its similar to the Dumpster Diver by uber dude Dane Reynolds. The Subscorcher has a volume of 27.3 litres at 5'8". Let's assume that's Kelly's board for small stuff.

So let's assume a 97kg Kelly Slater. What would he be riding? Extrapolating at 0.38 litres per kilogram a 97kg Kelly Slater, if he ever existed, would be riding a 36.86 litre SubScorcher. So he'd be riding the 6'2". That's the best surfer who ever existed would surf the 6'2" if he was ever that large.

I reckon for the purposes of argument most advanced surfers would need to ride at least 5% more volume than Kelly at a given weight. So a 72 kg guy might surf a 28.67 litre board if Kelly rode one at 27.3. That'd put them on the 5'10" SubScorcher. An intermediate might need 15% or 20% more assistance. So a 72kg intermediate might be better off on a 31.4 to 32.76 litre board, namely the 6'0". these are all two inches up on the recommended lengths in the buyers guide by the way and I'm not advancing this advice specifically - it's just an argument using real figures for illustrative purposes.

But most surfers aren't Kelly Slater. They're less talented (doh), if they're over 25 they're almost certainly heavier, surf a lot less, are less fit etc etc. If they're older they're slower to their feet. So a 97kg Kelly Slater might surf a 6'2" Sub Scorcher but a 97kg everyday intermediate older bloke is going to need more help. Even an advanced healthy guy at that weight would probably need the 6'4" (based on my assumptions) on the theory he needs 5% more forgiveness from his boards.

Just sayin'!

Just having a bit of fun with this. Bear with me;

Taj 72 kg favourite stick 5'11 Taj 24.41 litres = 0.34 litres per kilo.

Parko 85kg favourite stick 6'1" (used Flexfire as reference but added 3% as Parko's boards appear to be fuller) 26.18 litres = 0.31 litres per kilo

The Spartan 75kg favourite stick 6'0" x 18" x 2 5/16" (used 6'0" Taj 25.5 and Alternator 28.7 for volume and averaged) 27.1 = 0.37 litres per kilo.

Jordy 86kg (yeah right) favourite stick 6'2.5" x 19 1/8" x 2.5" (a little more volume than an Alternator but used Alt as reference) 31.3 litres 0.37 litres per kilo.

So my rule of thumb has the best pros in the land on between 0.31 and 0.38 litres per kilo. Parko looks to be an outlier.

I always think around 0.35l per kg works well for HPSBs. Grovellers would be a little more.

Hey Buzzy,
If you haven't read this already you'll like it.
Scroll down to the big guys and shortboards volume section.
http://www.rustysurf.com/website/category/blog-talkingdesign/page/3/

Hey buzzy that's pretty interesting as a matter of fact

Thanks cuttlefish. Rusty's advocating pretty foamed up boards for big guys (ie 200lbs plus). Bigger than even Grant Miller in Sydney shapes (for folk outside Oz Grant is a favourite of the 35+ crowd for older bloke shortboards).

Thanks Iggy.

Buzzy - good calculations on the Volume per keg of body weight.... that means for my dainty 97 kegs with a 6'6" Dominator (45.1 litre) that my ratio would be 0.4639. that sounds to me like a fair bit of "fat" (excuse the pun) built into the calculations when compared to what the guns of the world ride....and I am far from a gun.

It's also interesting to read the Rusty recommendations - according to that site I'd be targetting something in the 7' to 7' 3" range, 21" wide and 2.75" thick...this would have less volume than my current board (Mccoy 7' * 22" * 3") but probably not enough of a step down to even warrant looking at it.

I'm going to try out a 6' 6" Dominator and see how I go - like Cuttlefish suggested, if it doesn't feel quite right I could flick it

To know the volumes of a Rusty and a McCoy we'd need to be able to compare in litreages which McCoy's don't have (no machine/computer shaping program in use) but I'd bet my bottom dollar the McCoy will still have more volume as the thickness is carried through nose to tail and rail to rail : including thicker rails and the tail will be wider as well.
That aside have a run on a 6'6" demo and get back to us.
Don't forget there's a 6'8" spitfire up my way which has a more performance orientated tail than a dom.
Re Grant Miller: my old v-skate was 6'8" X 21" X 2 3/4" back 5 years ago. 

To add some balance I must comment on this. I have surfed for 40+ years and would consider myself to be advanced (on my good days anyway). Even at 53 I still get some respect from the young blokes at my local (maybe they feel sorry for me). Anyway I've always been pretty fit and a good swimmer and done a few other endurance sports competitively...so I will swim against the tide on this thread! I am currently between 91-93kg (if you weigh yourself daily it can vary this much any week based on drinking, eating and defecation cycles - charming huh?).

A mate bought a 6'4 dominator he was at 105kg then and it floated him easily and he caught plenty of waves. His background was similar to mine and also surfed heaps in younger years but kind of stopped for a while and had a 7'0 fish thing and then bought the dom after a few months surfing again. Based on his experience and the volume calculator on this site the 6'0 dom was right for me. He's down to about 90kg now and wants to go with less volume. I never even considered the 6'4 because of my mate - just way too much volume. Up to a point volume helps but then there is timing and positioning that help too.

If you have your timing and positioning wired you can just about stand up on a wave on a no paddle take off. Improve this skill and the volume really only helps make it easy to paddle back out or up and down the beach if the peaks shifting around a lot. All you need then is the right amount of planing area under your feet to get you along, give or take some - remember George Greenough's spoon's - they worked on the same principle. Same with skim boards; I've seen some guys actually ride shore break waves by running into the surf jumping on and riding it out to the wave hitting it with a re-entry and then just rode along the peeling wave. Probably not your average skim boarder but it shows you what planing area does once combined with some velocity.

NZed23, I'd suggest the 6'2 if you are planning to advance your surfing. If you are fit and surfing 3 to 6 times a week there is no reason you won't - and then you will want to go down from the 6'6 or 6'4 in perhaps 6 months time but that will depend on you, who you surf with and the places you choose to surf and how much you want to challenge yourself. I read the link to Rusty's blog and while it is interesting reading - I'm thinking those numbers are very pessimistic against age and don't seem to bare out in reality either. I surf with guys from 20 to 50+ -fathers and sons, I haven't seen grandfather, father and son yet but I'm sure if we all keep surfing I will. Anyway, these guys are still all riding short boards 6'6 and less. I have plenty of mates that have beefed up and ride longboards too, but the guys that have kept in shape are all still on short boards.

So take Rusty's numbers with a grain of salt. I suppose they are based on an assumption that guys who are over 200lb are a worst case scenario in terms of skill and fitness.

A spectrum has different ends....
Not everyone fits in the middle.

True enough Slowman, but not me.

I reckon far too many people surf under volumed and/or underplaned boards, young and old.

buzzy said:

True enough Slowman, but not me.

I reckon far too many people surf under volumed and/or underplaned boards, young and old.